You just wonder how legitimate are these miracle claims in the 21st century? Strobel said. Strobel said that he has long believed that Jesus performed the miracles described in the Gospels. You don't mix, say, corrected and uncorrected measurements in a timeline unless you provide both at every time point you have. For 15 years she had been going downhill. People casually talk about God helping to find their car keys or help their sportsing team win, which are not miraculous but imply the intervention of the agent and thus fall under the same umbrella. The fact that they can only produce two or three, with serious procedural and reporting issues, is strong evidence that this effect is non-existent. Finally, this gripe about a naturalistic bias is completely misguided. Prior to that, she served as president of Case Western Reserve University from 2007 to 2020, where she encouraged interdisciplinary excellence, catalyzed institutional collaboration, and reinvigorated alumni engagement and fundraising. Converted to Pelican theme by Brian Blais. He became a Christian in 1981 shortly after he decided to investigate Jesus and the Christian faith after his wife became a Christian. What problems are you interested in? At any given time some member of the family was deathly sick from malaria or typhoid or something else. So welcome. And sometimes there's also a catch-22 because after so many years the medical documentation has been discarded. Kamil: so he basically said, look the way we do it is that we have, let's say seven different possible explanations, six of them are naturalistic which we can disconfirm using science and then the seventh is the explanation that God did it. Meanwhile, her muscles were atrophied. Likewise, Americans are quite prone to believing in the potential occurrence of miracles. If you want to, for our listeners, if you want to read a little bit more about it Craig's written a fairly lengthy book on the whole, the whole narrative of that called Impossible Love. In all of human history there has never been one single credible and fully verified miracle cure. Craig Keener: Yeah, and part of it was inherited through my academic training. We therefore have to design our investigation to reduce these biases and rule out other possible causes. So miracles aren't meant to be [inaudible] for the world's problems. And the way we proceed is that we use medical science to eliminate the six and we can't really confirm or disconfirm the last remaining one but because we eliminated all of the alternatives that must be the one right or at least it's reasonable to believe that this is the one -- it's the best explanation. So what made you want to go in this direction? And certainly one shouldn't be willing to upend ones knowledge of how the universe works based on one report by one doctor on one patient. ", Scott Rae: Yeah, so you had to, I guess you had to check your own-. If you complain that the standards are too high, then you don't belong on the playing field and you don't deserve to be taken seriously. My initial thought was that , A physics problem from a practice AP test came to my attention, when my daughter was in AP physics this past spring. Yeah, I think of my friend Nabeel Qureshi. also understands AAU and the broader university and scientific communities end of the fall 2020 semester. The outcome was either a change in vision or hearing. Dying M.S. Meanwhile, her muscles were atrophied. Thinking about the Snyder "miracle", I do wonder why in these cases there isn't much more extensive medical documentation? What would happen if two people out in space a few meters apart, abandoned by their spacecraft, decided to wait until gravity pulled them together? So even when, you know it doesn't happen to all of us. I think it also is evident that the theists aren't serious about studying these things, and are content to believe things on bad evidence. From the Send Proof film they admit that they can't publish Bruce Van Natta case because the accurate measurement of the length of intestine needed to verify the result we don't have the technology yet. Craig Keener: In Matthew 11 and Luke Chapter 7, John the Baptist sends to Jesus because he hears the works of Jesus, he hears of these healings taking place and he says, "Are you the one the come or shall we wait for somebody else?" It is a reasonable question to ask -- how much evidence is enough? It also includes the audio recording of Duane Miller as he is being spontaneously healed of his permanent, severe vocal chord damage. The deaf will hear. Chris Gunderson who was born with an incurable disorder called Chronic Pseudo Obstruction Syndrome, which was cured by prayer. It's been shown that there is a high survival rate for patients with their heart rhythm responds to shocks. She heard a voice saying, "My child, rise up and walk." If the Anchor.fm widget isnt showing up above, click here to listen. in social ethics from the University of Southern California, a Th.M. I think we could say your relationship with Medine and how you guys, the two of you made it together, counts as one of those major miracles in your life. "It got to the point where she was dying. He is, let's just say he is one of the most prolific biblical scholars that I'm aware of and is so productive. It also highlights the need for detailed timelines to establish what the effect really is, before trying to grasp at causes. He has a Ph.D. and M.A. That said, before writing The Case for Miracles, Strobel was ambivalent about whether these miracles still happen today. A prolific author, he has written numerous bible commentaries and other works in biblical studies, in addition to his 2 volume work, Miracles. Despite several operations and treatments, Barbara continued to deteriorate to the point that she was put into respite with doctor's orders not to resuscitate. If someone gets healed, you often can't get back in contact with that person -- "it almost feels like if a miracle happens you have about 48 hours and then their gone". And he went to a retreat for the healing of the mind. Dr. Craig Keener holds the F.M. It's still healing. It's not the fullness. You need to collect the records, have a medical professional who can actually make sense of that data, and have a medical specialist who is willing to look at the data. "But my skepticism didn't go away.". After you lace up your boots, hit the trail. Scott Rae: Close, Medine. It's all just ad hoc special pleading. Scott Rae: And then she made it safely to the U.S. and then you were reunited again. As she listened, she said that she heard a male voice coming from the corner of the rooma voice she now believes was God. Barbara Snyder arrived at a A question also came out that if the scientific standard seems too high for these theists, in which discipline would the standard not be too high? And there were a number of other people who also, who were there at the occasion, who knew him before and after, who could testify to this. You can received notifications daily or weekly. At this point anyone with any reasonable familiarity with how to assess the quality of medical studies should see that this is a worthless study. Craig Keener: Yeah. But again, it's a sign. All subjects demonstrated improvement from the intervention. Likewise, Americans are quite prone to believing in the potential occurrence of miracles. Is it possible that there was MS and something else, in which case looking for a full recovery from MS is misdirected? I am confident that Case Western In particular, it includes an interview with Barbara Snyder, who was instantaneously healed from advanced multiple sclerosis, as also attested by her two physicians. It is justified to demand better evidence, because we do that for even more modest claims, and we have centuries of data on the failings of human reasoning in inferring causes from effects. Once you admit that getting a pool table after prayer is a miracle, then you've admitted that your standards of evidence are outrageously poor. He is the F.M. Quoting myself here (from this post). Half received prayer; the other half didnt. I sort of think that these popular apologetics books will briefly touch on some of these tools that should be used but then that's a stand-in that makes people think that they're actually using them. To be charitable to Elijah's point, perhaps he's meaning that if you pray for someone yourself in an impossible situation and there is improvement, you can tell the difference between the fake and real miracle personally. "You just wonder how legitimate are these miracle claims in the 21st century?" But you've written a two volume set over, excess of a 1000 pages on the subject of miracles. I mean I tried to get accounts from all sorts of different cultures. By this point, she was almost blind and . "Barbara Snyder was diagnosed at the Mayo Clinic with multiple sclerosis. He was 2200 in one eye and 2400 in the other and had already been through training for the blind. Scott Rae: Here, here. When his wife prayed, having been told that he was gone, the heart monitor "sprang back to life" and then the doctors were able to revive him. Counter Apologist Discussion, I highly recommend starting with this since it delves into at least three of the sources I discussed. Craig thanks so much for being with us. There isn't anything that could tie the prayer as the causal element, given that she was most likely prayed for often an we're picking out the one case before a claimed recovery. It's not biased to be skeptical. Barbara Rook "Babs" Snyder is an American academic and president of the Association of American Universities. Sometimes God uses things. She did it. She was miraculously healed. Craig Keener: Which is her first language. I love this Bible study!" A Barbara Sent Home to Die Let me tell you now about a different Barbara, Barbara Cummiskey.2 When she was a teenager, doctors diagnosed Barbara with multiple sclerosis (MS). If something is real, when we can more carefully observe it, it becomes easier to see not harder. One needs larger than \(N=1\) to establish these effects -- which is why case studies are so ineffective at doing so. That's what he was praying for. I cook breakfast sandwich and lunch sandwichs I'm also a cashier. 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